Holder Item Edit/Fix

So Holder magic has come to be an issue recently with people abusing the fact that holder items cannot be broken and then registering them as a weapon/armor/item to have a indestructible holder item.

So a quick fix to this can be we make it so if they register the item that it has a durability equal to the rules of the rank of item(if they don't register the item it stays a regular item with no abilities but it indestructible). Then we can go with..

1. Saying that the weapon loses all of its abilities if it breaks but can still be used as a conduit for spells.

2. We go with each holder item having a regen time for when it is repaired in a thread after breaking. I'm thinking 3 posts in PvP and 1 post outside of PvP(This has to be a post that is decently sized depending on the thread) and while broken the user cannot use any of the item's abilities but can use spells that can work while the weapon is broken. - This is my pick.

Also there was a mention of UAs being needed to give your item abilities in your magic if you do not register it which I think you should be allowed both as a holder magic user which gives holder magic a uniqueness that other magic does not have due to them focusing so much on the item they use. Also we should have it that holder weapons cannot be eaten by the slayer using them.

This is due to a idea someone had that they could just eat the 'holder' bone weapon they had as a bone slayer and just eat it continuously. I know it goes against the rules already because if a slayer is a holder that means they are creating the weapons they use which means they can't eat it and also slayers are naturally casters to begin with so yeah. Lots of bs but to avoid it we can add that as a rule. Also if they have a secondary that has a holder item of the element that they can eat that they cannot eat it because it is indestructible. If they register the item and eat it then they will have to eat it all and will have to replace that item(either buying a new one or doing a certain amount of words in a thread)

What do you guys think? Which do you like more out of the options? And anything you want to add?

I do prefer the second one imo, it may be more creative and effective that in plot and it just seems more balance in the name of zen.

(and yeah, that bs part needs added too xD)

2. We go with each holder item having a regen time for when it is repaired in a thread after breaking. I'm thinking 3 posts in PvP and 1 post outside of PvP(This has to be a post that is decently sized depending on the thread) and while broken the user cannot use any of the item's abilities but can use spells that can work while the weapon is broken. - This is my pick.

I feel this muddies an already convoluted system on the site. Durability on this site is, in my opinion, stupid and should just be removed altogether. I would rather have the idea of disarming someone of their holder equipment (armor might be a bit more difficult to accomplish) than outright added regen to the already mucked up durability system.

Keep in mind, nobody really keeps track of their weapon/armor/item durability during a battle (whether it's PvP or PvE) so adding this would simply make something that should be pretty straight forward more of a complicated mess.
I also feel adding this system would completely cripple someone who decided to have Holder Magic; which puts people with Caster Magic in a position of advantage. All Holder/Caster magic should be is an aesthetic choice instead of a real system choice.

Also there was a mention of UAs being needed to give your item abilities in your magic if you do not register it which I think you should be allowed both as a holder magic user which gives holder magic a uniqueness that other magic does not have due to them focusing so much on the item they use. Also we should have it that holder weapons cannot be eaten by the slayer using them.

Waste of a UA for something that should be inherent to an aesthetic choice.

This is due to a idea someone had that they could just eat the 'holder' bone weapon they had as a bone slayer and just eat it continuously. I know it goes against the rules already because if a slayer is a holder that means they are creating the weapons they use which means they can't eat it and also slayers are naturally casters to begin with so yeah. Lots of bs but to avoid it we can add that as a rule. Also if they have a secondary that has a holder item of the element that they can eat that they cannot eat it because it is indestructible. If they register the item and eat it then they will have to eat it all and will have to replace that item(either buying a new one or doing a certain amount of words in a thread)

Easy fix. Just state that slayers cannot eat their own equipment. There's already a rule stating that they cannot eat their own spells, so why not extend this to not being able to eat their own equipment.
As for them having secondary, I'd say (once again) no. It is still their spell/equipment.
So simply stating that a slayer cannot eat spells/equipment belonging to them would easily fix this problem without making too many more overcomplicated rules.

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To be honest, this is being overcomplicated.
Simply state that you cannot eat your own gear and this will fix the issue. it's really not a holder issue, it's more of an oversight of the slayer rules.

As far as equipment is concerned, having durability for equipment, in general, is kinda silly to begin with. But that's a topic for another time.

Sometimes the easiest solution is generally the best. In this case, the easiest solution is to not allow people to eat their own stuff. Tada. Problem solved.

Anastasia Isayev wrote:

2. We go with each holder item having a regen time for when it is repaired in a thread after breaking. I'm thinking 3 posts in PvP and 1 post outside of PvP(This has to be a post that is decently sized depending on the thread) and while broken the user cannot use any of the item's abilities but can use spells that can work while the weapon is broken. - This is my pick.

I feel this muddies an already convoluted system on the site.  Durability on this site is, in my opinion, stupid and should just be removed altogether.  I would rather have the idea of disarming someone of their holder equipment (armor might be a bit more difficult to accomplish) than outright added regen to the already mucked up durability system.  

Keep in mind, nobody really keeps track of their weapon/armor/item durability during a battle (whether it's PvP or PvE) so adding this would simply make something that should be pretty straight forward more of a complicated mess.  
I also feel adding this system would completely cripple someone who decided to have Holder Magic; which puts people with Caster Magic in a position of advantage.  All Holder/Caster magic should be is an aesthetic choice instead of a real system choice.  

Also there was a mention of UAs being needed to give your item abilities in your magic if you do not register it which I think you should be allowed both as a holder magic user which gives holder magic a uniqueness that other magic does not have due to them focusing so much on the item they use. Also we should have it that holder weapons cannot be eaten by the slayer using them.

Waste of a UA for something that should be inherent to an aesthetic choice.

This is due to a idea someone had that they could just eat the 'holder' bone weapon they had as a bone slayer and just eat it continuously. I know it goes against the rules already because if a slayer is a holder that means they are creating the weapons they use which means they can't eat it and also slayers are naturally casters to begin with so yeah. Lots of bs but to avoid it we can add that as a rule. Also if they have a secondary that has a holder item of the element that they can eat that they cannot eat it because it is indestructible. If they register the item and eat it then they will have to eat it all and will have to replace that item(either buying a new one or doing a certain amount of words in a thread)

Easy fix.  Just state that slayers cannot eat their own equipment.  There's already a rule stating that they cannot eat their own spells, so why not extend this to not being able to eat their own equipment.  
As for them having secondary, I'd say (once again) no.  It is still their spell/equipment.  
So simply stating that a slayer cannot eat spells/equipment belonging to them would easily fix this problem without making too many more overcomplicated rules.

---

To be honest, this is being overcomplicated.  
Simply state that you cannot eat your own gear and this will fix the issue.  it's really not a holder issue, it's more of an oversight of the slayer rules.  

As far as equipment is concerned, having durability for equipment, in general, is kinda silly to begin with.  But that's a topic for another time.

Sometimes the easiest solution is generally the best.  In this case, the easiest solution is to not allow people to eat their own stuff.  Tada.  Problem solved.

The only issue with just leaving this all at "You can't eat your own equipment" is that people can still make indestructible registered holder items. The issue wasn't just that he could eat the item he made at all but if it really as seen as such by most of the devs(only really have seen 2-3 devs saying this at this point) then I can't do much.

I just don't see things like that because of my past with dealing with people who find loopholes on site. We honestly got lucky this even came out because no one else noticed it until he said something in the CB which means we need to be on top of patching up any holes we might have which having indestructible items sounds unrealistic.

Also, yes, durability can be dumb in some cases but it brings realism to using a weapon, armor or item. It is something that has been around to say that you can't just use your item to continually block attack after attack and it not suffer any damages because that is a loophole in itself that someone could use if there was no durability.

Yes, a person has control over what items they have that breaks but what if they abuse that too? We are on an RP site where everything is story so its hard for us to control how much people can actually do which in essence makes most of the work we do as devs null and void but that doesn't mean we just let people have their way where we can help balance the site out. That is what I'm trying to have us do with this. Balance things out that did not have balance because of a loophole that pertains to more than just one thing. (kind of rambled a bit here but yeah lol)